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Motorrad, Ton, Mikrofon, Vorverstärker?

Motorcycle, sound, Microphone, Preamplifier?



Frage von id073897:
März 2006

Hello,

after I have now found several posts in the search, there still remains a question open for me: If I want to film on a motorcycle, what kind of microphone do I connect s.besten? I use a SonyHC42 with helmet cam. The supplied microphone is there for a ton, I think that simply capitulated before the volume (for the non-biker:> 100db systems are indeed illegal, but still in vogue at the time ...)

What I've discovered: there are microphones for large volumes include, for example, to guitar amps or drums. That would surely synonymous right for me. It does not need to deliver top quality, because the engine noise is supposed to be only heard of on the Music. But more than just a noise floor, it should be. The noise comes through the wind of all alone.

What, then, with the preamp? I do not need the same, synonymous when I take a dynamic microphone that requires no power supply, right?

Gruss,
Gunter



Antwort von steveb:

Perhaps you could attach indeed a Clippmicro somewhere in the vicinity of the engine and mounted the opposite direction. Then the engine noise should be heard to ensure synonymous. Think that is mounted against the direction of travel, no preamp is needed.

gruss
Stefan



Antwort von Markus:

"Gunter" id073897 "" wrote:
The noise comes through the wind of all alone.

Hello Gunter,

against wind noise (rumble) by the wind helps one Windschutzfell. The longer the hair of the fur, the better the protection.

Possible suppliers:
Rovotech





Antwort von beiti:

Whenever it is loud, dynamic microphones are recommended. However, likely to be somewhat awkward on the bike in the handling / fixing.

Windschutzfell Rovotech is of very good tip. Who can operate a sewing machine, get the same thing but cheaper Eigenbau. (I've just opened a custom theme to it.)

What do you want with the preamp, I do not quite understand. Sowas is needed only if you want to connect a microphone s.line input (and 99% of camcorders have no line-input). On Microphone input you can connect directly to each microphone.



Antwort von id073897:

"beiti" wrote:
Whenever it is loud, dynamic microphones are recommended. However, likely to be somewhat awkward on the bike in the handling / fixing.


The microphone is probably in the backpack, the tank may be in the backpack or pocket. That, of course, compromising the sound to bring with me is clear, but given the wind noise seems to me to still make sense. My question is synonymous less towards the prevention of wind noise, but whether it specifically microphones for a relatively noisy environment there.

Quote:
What do you want with the preamp, I do not quite understand. Sowas is needed only if you want to connect a microphone s.line input (and 99% of camcorders have no line-input). On Microphone input you can connect directly to each microphone.


The camcorder has a video - In-port that I use for the helmet camera, and the cable for the helmet camera is synonymous to the connector for the microphone. This is a standard - RCA connector. Can I go directly connect a dynamic Microsystems? I had always thought that it would not, and therefore there would be pre-amplifier. But I am admittedly complete layman in the field. With its own microphone input, I knew nothing, and offered at only Sonywird Micro with an external connector on the Zuberhörschuh. If I have understood correctly, then we switched to this input, however, when the video input is used.

Gruss,
Gunter



Antwort von beiti:

Quote:
The camcorder has a video - In-port that I use for the helmet camera, and the cable for the helmet camera is synonymous to the connector for the microphone. This is a standard - RCA connector. Can I go directly connect a dynamic Microsystems?
You have absolutely right. This is a special case. If the microphone directly with the line input of the receiving camcorder is connected to a preamplifier is needed.
I am unfortunately not so well informed that portable amplifier for such purposes, there is.

Quote:
The microphone is probably in the backpack, the tank may be in the backpack or pocket. That, of course, compromising the sound to bring with me is clear, but given the wind noise seems to me to still make sense.
Normally, I would advise of sowas, but in the case of engine noise, it seems to me to be a reasonable compromise.



Antwort von id073897:

Great, then we are agreed, and I have no doubt s.meinem Halbwissen :-)

I will then durchgooglen times through the topic a bit, what I find so through portable preamplifier.

Hmm, reminds me just so I could not synonymous my intercom at the Mopped abusing it? Can we measure it somehow? What needs to come out for from such a connection, that it is suitable for line-level input? And what values should not be exceeded? Is there somewhere a tutorial video for dummies?

Thank you for your help!

Gruss,
Gunter



Antwort von beiti:

Quote:
I could not synonymous my intercom at the Mopped abusing it? Can we measure it somehow? What needs to come out for from such a connection, that it is suitable for line-level input?
Which should provide a more determined ... eidene sound quality. I do not synonymous think she has a line output. In case you have the headphones output to the line input will, would have a damping circuit (voltage divider) is necessary. An electronics engineer could certainly calculate the necessary resistance. Fine regulation then goes through the volume control.



Antwort von beiti:

I just that) found here (for users with difficult soldering:
http://www.mercateo.com/p/102-197688 (2d) BP / MONO_MIKROFON_VORVERSTAeRKER_BAUSATZ.html



Antwort von id073897:

Okay, I think, make me more surely in search of a real amplifier. Craft a solution I do not like so much experience, you will end up but at what professionally made. At least if I start putting stuff :-)

Danke & Gruss,
Gunter



Antwort von beiti:

The problem is that "real" preamp same very high quality parts with XLR connector, phantom power, etc.. Few of them are designed for battery operation, and if they are really expensive. Relatively bulky, they are not synonymous.

For your purposes, would be a "amateurmäßiger" Microphone preamplifier (such as a camcorder completely sufficient). Unfortunately, there is hardly buy that separately.
Of Hama, there is a reasonable s.HiFi about connecting plants, but has a bit of synonymous and portable housing need (I think) a power supply.

EDIT: What kind of microphone / preamplifier was there because with the helmet camera?



Antwort von id073897:

"beiti" wrote:
What kind of microphone / preamplifier was there because with the helmet camera?


In fairness, my answer to that question would be: yes, it was a Microphone with this :-) However, I can no longer be used with this information, as this picture shows:

zum Bild

To say it in justice: that part is höllenempfindlich so you could hear Flies running. But that's why, for my purpose is not at all suitable.

Gruss,
Gunter



Antwort von beiti:

It looks quite interesting.
First, the power supply via the DC Plug to (presumably fed from the same source as the camera itself seems). This socket / power source could possibly be used for any other amplifier, so that at least the battery does problem.
Secondly, I think that the thickening) in the cable (on the left side of the rolled-Stillimage part contains a preamplifier, which could possibly synonymous with using a different microphone.
Thirdly, I would imagine with that there are ways to curb this microphone in any way. Perhaps requires only a variable resistor in the supply line to RCA Male. (But makes use anything, even if the microphone is already overloaded.)



Antwort von id073897:

"beiti" wrote:
First, the power supply via the DC Plug to (presumably fed from the same source as the camera itself seems).

The Micro will be looped into the power of the camera. Basically, I have no problem with a vehicle with the power supply, but rather with the power :-)

Quote:
Secondly, I think that the thickening) in the cable (on the left side of the rolled-Stillimage part contains a preamplifier, which could possibly synonymous with using a different microphone.

The preamplifier is located directly below the microphone capsule, in which pieces of heat shrink tubing. It has annoyed me though, is opening your views, but actually I know what's in it: a perfectly ordinary preamp with OpAmp and a handful of passive components in SMD format. This is the 08/15-Variante, which can be found everywhere.

Quote:
Thirdly, I would imagine with that there are ways to curb this microphone in any way. Perhaps requires only a variable resistor in the supply line to RCA Male. (But makes use anything, even if the microphone is already overloaded.)

The latter, I fear. Not that I could justify in any way :-( From the sound of her it sounds as if there was electronical run amok.

However that may be synonymous, I did last summer and her tried out, with a different capsule, with self-built preamplifiers. As I said, although I can solder together something just yet, but I do not understand. So slowly, I would still like to hear quite synonymous times a better result, especially as the permanent synonymous test drives are not quite inexpensively. Ergo: it probably does not help, I'll have to handle money and buy equipment. I rumgesucht a little bit, and found suitable microphone types: AKG D409 or Sennheiser E604, for example. I'm going to try to get one on eBay cheap. With preamps siehts rather mau out, I have to look a bit longer. Parts of the tube, I suspect, because of the fall Einsatzbedingugen probably out :-)

Gruss,
Gunter



Antwort von beiti:

My experience with microphones show that the differences between cheap professional microphones and microphones are conceivable brand and low to justify the price difference is not usually. I have, for example, dynamic microphones of Behringer for 30 ¬, whose loud voice and recording sources (wind music) sound quite excellent. I also could directly Comparison realize that not much-praised video of directional microphones Beyerdynamic despite ¬ 400 purchase delivered audibly better sound quality than my 100 - ¬-Hama (possibly directional characteristics of the Beyer Dynamics) is a little stronger.
Between different preamps I've noticed quite audible differences. When I s.meinem MD recorder same microphone either directly s.Mikrofoneingang and then plug in a good external preamp s.line input, one may not believe that there still is the same microphone, but concerns vsdie clarity in the highs and the noise, both of which would be for your purpose is not so important. The biggest problem I still see the power supply on the road. Also, most pre-amplifier design rather than desktop devices, I do not know if we can accommodate s.Motorrad.

Here's a link to pre-amplifiers:
http://www.thomann.de/de/preamps.html

And here about dynamic microphones:
http://www.thomann.de/de/allroundmikrofone_dynamisch.html



Antwort von Markus:

"beiti" wrote:
I also could directly Comparison realize that not much-praised video of directional microphones Beyerdynamic despite ¬ 400 purchase delivered audibly better sound quality than my 100 - ¬-Hama ...

A Sennheiser ME66 (about 400 ¬) sounds much better one s.als Hama RMZ-10 (approx. 70 ¬). Of course, the sound difference is not so far apart like 5-6 times the price difference, but it is there for a reason why professionals use such expensive microphones.

"beiti" wrote:
http://www.thomann.de/de/ allround _dynamisch.html

Allround ...?! * aaaarghhhhh! *



Antwort von id073897:

Thanks for the tips and links. But these are probably stramme Prices that are being maintained in the audio industry. And I always thought that bikes were already expensive :-)

I'm getting time on the search,'s see what I can raise.

Danke & Gruss,
Gunter



Antwort von beiti:

Quote:
Allround ...?! * aaaarghhhhh! *
Tieeef breathe! :-)

It's all clear to me that expensive microphones, depending on the application, their money may be worth.
But I have observed that some filmmakers misconceptions of the sound benefits of more expensive mics (especially if they have no idea of the correct application and my example to achieve with an expensive shotgun microphone from 100 meters distance from a super sound quality) .

In the pure amateur range (eg, plastic microphone with fixed cable and 3.5mm jack) I have been synonymous staying true lousy microphones, but professional microphones, with which I was allowed to work (the cheap synonymous), all were usable. The audible for normal ears advantage expensive brand microphones is then really low - even in this video applications. (For music recordings, perhaps one would have to apply more stringent standards.)

Quote:
But these are probably stramme Prices that are being maintained in the audio industry. And I always thought that bikes were already expensive :-)
As Normalo one must decide for themselves just an expensive hobby. ;)



Antwort von prem:

Portable, battery powered mic So, I know two:

Billo, but GOOD: PreMobile 2

http://www.musik-produktiv.de/shop2/shop04.asp/sid/! 18121995/artnr/100009940/quelle/hits

Expensive:

http://www.thomann.de/de/rme_quadmic.htm



Antwort von id073897:

"Anonymous" wrote:
Billo, but GOOD: PreMobile 2

http://www.musik-produktiv.de/shop2/shop04.asp/sid/! 18121995/artnr/100009940/quelle/hits


For this model, I then decided synonymous to hold together with a T. Bone micro-tool once the costs within reasonable limits. Yesterday I made my first test drive and noticed that one needs to turn up the preamp but orderly. The sound was then much better than before, until just the wind noise drown out everything. But that's another problem, how can I get it under control, I do not know yet. On the Mopped winds it's just everywhere, somehow.

Thank you in any case until all the views that have helped me!

One last question remains for me but still I have the impression that the ignition system, which is indeed quite close s.Tankrucksack scatters in the sound disorders. This is something of her old car radios. In cars, this is now well suppressed, but at my old part ... Are there any tips for shielding? Metal box and everything s.Masse basket? I would have expected that the metal fuel tank provides enough shielding, but who knows what the camcorder that captures everything yet.

Gruss,
Gunter



Antwort von *:

What is the sound you want? Aufnehemen The Motorradknattern during a trip? Since you will probably be disappointed despite the wind. A Micro will include primarily wind noise, which override the Kameravorverstärker. Keep it to the rehearsal, the camera to the car window, and accelerate to 80km / h. Then you have a rough idea of the sounds that are still being recorded. A Low Cost Solution: binding a couple of minidisc recorders, mp3 recorder, battery-operated cassette recorders, etc. s.verschiedenen bodies s.ein "good" sounding motorcycle (under the tank for engine noise, between No. shield and guard plate for exhaust noise, etc. .). Turn off all devices to "record" and make a few shots at idle (idle-gebrab-bb-bel) to turn a couple of times s.Gasgriff (wwwrumm-wwwrummm), turning a few laps in the 1st Course with a lot of hit and hold, a few laps in the 2nd Gang, etc.
Import everything into the PC and it'll make you a good dubbing snippets. If your video editing program compatible multiple audio tracks, you can do everything in one step. This is the cheapest way with the maximum result! No person in the world can tell if motor XY by a studio mic "real" sounds as if through a consumer-Mik! We hear motors to 99% by "disturbed" external conditions (helmet, wind noise, car windows, other traffic and the ears on the "wrong" place, etc.). So I would recommend any new purchases only because of that. Unless you want to do while driving vocal recordings with Celine Dion;-o



Antwort von george87:

"*" Wrote:
What is the sound you want? Aufnehemen The Motorradknattern during a trip? Since you will probably be disappointed despite the wind. A Micro will include primarily wind noise, which override the Kameravorverstärker.


With the limits are probably already fairly clear. With what I have now, I come to just under 100 km / h more portable to a conclusion. As already written, it needs to be a hifi, but should be placed only in the dub.

Quote:
Import everything into the PC and it'll make you a good dubbing snippets.


That is not enough for people who drive themselves. Especially if they have the same model. Everyone has the sound in your ears and you will quickly notice differences. Especially when the rev counter in the picture looks ...

An example (not of me):

http://www.buellowner.ch/MOVIES/auftakt.wmv

It is absorbed directly with the digicam, strapped to his chest, no external micro. From the sound of the engine noise, it is sufficient. The Micro was ohrenscheinlich covered, at least it sounds for me like that.

Quote:
No person in the world can tell if motor XY by a studio mic "real" sounds as if through a consumer-Mik!


Of that I'm gone anyway. Only with the equipment that I had before, I get no reasonable result. Now I am at least have something next.

Gruss,
Gunter



Antwort von Axel:

Dear beiti, Gunter and *,
finally people who are worried about the right sound. What many here are probably looking for sheer hair-splitting is in fact the respect that we should turn our "hobby". Let's have it right tubes, but remember: The hochfidele meticulous recording of the correct frequencies with Speeezialmikros anything with (the feeling of the driver or do the bunny shocked that hopefully it creates). Please, no fear of filters and effects.




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