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Jetzt habe ich den Salat......Klavierkonzert filmen mit Pana 707

Now I have the mess ...... Piano Concerto film with Pana 707



Frage von Debug:
April 2010

In my circle of friends has (unfortunately rumgesprochen) that I've started with filming, and I have been asked to film a piano concert by a pianist from our friends.

Apart from the fact that the ne number is probably still too big for me, I said yes anyway.

Perhaps there are basic tips on things you should avoid at all costs, and you should pay attention to, etc. Links to similar sites

Synonymous course I realize that I work with an external microphone must be (here synonymous perhaps a hint?). And you should use a synonymous for lenses? If so what kind?

To the concert itself, I have so far only the following information:

1st proper concert hall with stage, capacity 800 audience
2nd The lighting seems "typical" to be, which means always the
3rd I may post the camera everywhere (with the exception of the wing probably ;-)))

I'm thankful for every tip.

Many greetings, Debug



Antwort von joey23:

You only have one cam available? Then this is nothing.

1st Cam over the shoulder of the pianist
2nd Cam on the face of the pianist
3rd Cam shot wings and pianist, with s.and s.Schwenk to guests and other details

Joey



Antwort von Dr. Walter Gesierich:

joey23's right. I am synonymous advised before about 8 years in this track as a concert-and theater filmmakers. Even if the resulting video will be used only in private: alone with a camera that is a tough story. That is the unjust: Oh, you could film the concert times, but each lay unconscious s.Schluß compares with minutely planned concert recordings in public television.
That with the cameras is clear, therefore, the tip of joey23 right to the point. Look, where you can still raise additional filmmakers have (your video a club nearby?).
I'm the sound engineer with us. For that is the next problem. To external sound not you come around shan.
For driving to work it all depends on whether you in the direction of making more like. For the fact I can not Billigschiene Tips. If you want to buy one but you for life Earthenware, because let me know, I write a long story ...
It greets you Walter





Antwort von Debug:

Joey23 @
@ Dr. Walter Gesierich

Many thanks for your tips / hints.

Well, who asks a question (like me) who has to expect a response so synonymous get ;-))))

I have written you of the time taken to heart, and now is probably synonymous for professional care pickup. However, it is a horror in front of me now, cut all the material and afterwards syncron bring together. Time, quite apart from that I have not until now synonymous course be damned, what form it will make me sound available.

Get views on amazon browse what's on this topic Sun

But let's face it .... makes the whole thing because with such a consumer cam like the 707 Pana any sense?

How funny ..... not a day old the subject, and I already growing on your head ;-)

Thanks and many greetings, Debug



Antwort von Frank B.:

It is here in the forum a number of contributions relating to film concerts. This is really a charming story synonymous for amateurs, when you can learn this and only this is synonymous. Unfortunately, to the detriment of those who expect something of you. I agree with previous speakers. At least 3 cameras are necessary to improve even more. Synchronization with each other and with external audio material is not very problematic when recording s.einem piece without the cameras to turn out during the concert.
But for that you will inform yourself better in the great number of contributions on this topic here in the forum.
Search for concert recordings, concerts and audio dubbing.

Frank



Antwort von campool:

Hi!

Concrete Tip: Enter your 707 as a long shot, twice for cheap money on ebay NV-GS Series (s.besten s.GS 60, as Anamorphic widescreen -> or just 4:3, with a piano can be very long .. . ;-))... And something as Tripod or replacing it - enough!

Good luck!

Tim

PS: Professional cameras are not really big! Think times: three times a NV-GS, or, better still, to 1080p in HF 20 (Canon) and a beautiful cut - that's a dream ;-)



Antwort von srone:

with only one camera you will actually only the right area on the stage and a roll spider can, then you pianist (in) large through the opened wings, medium shot wings with pianist make (in), if you then with the rolling spinning in the middle the stage behind the pianist (the pianist) on the dark stage hopefully (same synonymous black bear) move to make with a total audience in hinergrund and large hands. longer with a camera in my view to not make it.

lg

SRone



Antwort von K.-D. Schmidt:

Quote:
At least 3 cameras are necessary to improve even more.

Sure! You rent a car and recording 12 cameras, and you can if you get dazumietest still appropriate picture-and sound engineers to achieve a useful result.

Now we remain realistic times!
You have ONE Camera. And that thou shalt take up the concert. And you can synonymous. I know the room and can not therefore advise you not how did you set up. If you find a position with which you, the pianist of the front so get onto Picture that you have your hands on the synonymous with Tastutur in the Picture, a few times already won. Location might be slightly increased not bad. Then you take on: the pianist with wing views, and stick to the head, sometimes only the hands, sometimes a long shot, sometimes a swing through the orchestra (I assume that exists). Do it by always quiet and slowly zoom out. This is what the end result of it not as bad as you want to persuade you here. It's just a Amateuaufnahme, which must be clear.


Quote:
... And a spider roll ...

The pianist will be warmly thank synonymous (and the Orchestra), if you constantly with herumkreist a spider roll on stage, even if it is well oiled (the spider roll)!
This one will probably ban you quickly if there is a regular public concert.

Greeting
KDS



Antwort von srone:

"K.-D. Schmidt" wrote:
If you find a position with which you, the pianist of the front so get onto Picture that you have your hands on the synonymous with Tastutur in the Picture, a few times already won. Location might be slightly increased not bad.


na, the position would be well centered on the stage in front of the Piano when the times goes well.

lg

SRone



Antwort von K.-D. Schmidt:

Quote:
na, the position would be well centered on the stage in front of the piano,

Nonsense!
Since you're so good advice there, I guess you've already filmed concerts often. Maybe even a gallery of views from the room or just out with increased Tripod?

Greeting
KDS



Antwort von Bernd E.:

"Joey23" wrote:
... You've only got a cam available? Then nothing ...

As a general rule I would not say, especially since the movie is not so obviously must meet BBC requirements. With a little creativity can make up quite a lot.

"Debug" wrote:
... Perhaps there are basic tips ...

At a public event of this size there is probably a dress rehearsal? Then make sure that any other musician and pianist wearing the same clothes as later at the concert and turning everything you need to loosen s.Motiven, while the sample in which you normally free before you can use / move on or behind the stage: close-ups of the pianist, her hands on the keyboard, etc.
At the concert then you limit yourself to a large extent on the long shot, artists and audience do not disturb next, and afterwards, you can use the two shots in such piecing that the impression of a Mehrkameraaufnahme.



Antwort von markus-s:

Take as many things already in the sample, served vor-/nachträglich Asked close-ups that you can Reinsch cut at any time (she be wearing the same clothes and sit on the same stage as possible ;-).

If you have fewer cameras, then it proves itself in the rule to include before and after a lot of additional material: In a close-up of the face provides None, whether belonging to the current piece - with a close-up of piano playing finger is for a qualified audience something different (Remember 08/15-Seher itself is not always when it is cut well).

Good luck
Markus

EDIT: Ha ... Bernd was faster ...



Antwort von Bernd E.:

Good tips can give you not often enough ;-)



Antwort von srone:

yes I have, with an approximately 1m high with the optics stage you need to have at least 2.5 m high in the audience for this picture of you to have described, and from a lateral, more zoom, the camera of him not loge do, there will either face or hands, as a piano in a regular cross stands on stage, pianist (in) the left wing on the right.

lg

SRone



Antwort von B.DeKid:

"Debug" wrote:
In my circle of friends has (unfortunately rumgesprochen) that I've started with filming, and I have been asked to film a piano concert by a pianist from our friends.

Apart from the fact that the ne number is probably still too big for me, I said yes anyway.

.....


Why have you promised - I had never done.

If you are messing up the talks around the synonymous.

MfG
B. DeKid



Antwort von Frank B.:

My experience - and I stick to it - with a camera is the only Gestümper. It may be that some people actually see of the beginning to end, possibly even the pianist and the director of photography, but then only once. Something like this is quickly boring and annoying, especially if the concert will take longer than 15 minutes;). Who is the eternal and Geschwenke Gezoome reinziehen then? Insertschnitte by the public or from the space environment are good. They are synonymous can make in advance or later and incorporated in the post. The Recording with only a camera and possibly even without a separate audio recording requires but a continuous camera recording the entire concert, otherwise it comes to audio jumps. Ie all transitions in the shot size must be realized by zoom or pan. The whole then perhaps on a tripod in class under 50-Euro.
I do not know!
It can not be that hard, is still on loan to two or three cameras of friends. can be synonymous align in a somewhat greater distance on tripods on the events and thus generate different settings. With the hand-held camera to film then the detailed close-ups. This I would do with a cheap audio recorder a separate audio recording. This provides a consistent, well hopefully disqualified sound. When run through all the cameras, then you need this sound and the different camera views to synchronize only once (in the timeline). We search for the respective video track from the right picture. The whole still peppered with some nice Insertbildern and already has one which some show-and listenable.
I personally take no orders for more concert recordings, unless I have at least 3 - 4 cameras available. I get the circle of acquaintances, sometimes even including "cameraman", together even in high-quality play.

Frank



Antwort von derpianoman:

The best you remember what films suitable for Reinsch crop, such as where you stumbled on this pianissimo in the Adagio are via cable, -) So, for example, images of the Vltava River, Mr. Beethoven when shopping, the pianist or the like in your garden. Just piano eh boring! ,-)))



Antwort von Jitter:

Debug,
after you have already promised, here are a Council, as you can with the resources available to you realiser s.einfachsten.
Of films beginning to end in a setting (perhaps laterally offset a pianist, so look on her face is synonymous). When an entire orchestra would provide camera movement in a single artist rather not.
The sound is still "taken off professionally. Will spare you the trouble of connecting to subsequently Picture and Sound (before I'd synonymous gray), but redirect the sound from the mixer (or the VCR) directly to the SD 707 in the microphone input. This works, you have only manual herunterpegeln strong, so there you probably will get a line signal nud no micro-signal.



Antwort von domain:

A viable solution may be synonymous to some with some settings on to the interpreter before or after the actual performance, because of special importance for video and all.
These settings should never show their hands and the buttons, but otherwise each perspective.
And these clips then you cut into easy-to-end recording, even if it just fits.



Antwort von Dr. Walter Gesierich:

The tip with the recording snippets at the dress rehearsal, I find an idea for a lone saugute.
But look a look in your neighborhood, as there is intended a Film Club / Video Club. Then run around a lot of people who are happy about such a job, 2 and 3rd Cameraman to be. One or the other has the right idea, even for this concert stories. Of our 48 members, I would recommend you first go to 10 - 12, which you could take at face value. With a little luck do not cost you something, because as much fun s.ihrem hobby that they otherwise would have to pay entertainment tax.
Such a greetings encouragingly, Walter



Antwort von Blackeagle123:

I think it is very important to ask: How is your friend before the matter? Hang out with him, sit down with him a long time together and enlighten exactly to customer requirements.

Maybe he just wants to have only one camera is the s.FOH (if it would be the "FOH" are?).

Perhaps it is synonymous to him too much when a camera is on stage and close-ups still filming?

I can generally agree: either right and stand for his name to remain, or. Anyway, I say this now synonymous friend so and call you the Prices for professional work. I tell you, but synonymous, the technique could stand up favorably and then just stands there is only one camera, then give you an unedited DVD, but say synonymous equal to that I will be there not edit the sound, the correct picture or the like. ;-)
But the only times in passing.

Greetings!



Antwort von Debug:

Wow! Many many thanks s.Euch all, for the great tips, such as synonymous the Recommendation, not even in my friends circle stamped as untalented idiots video ;-)

Because the sound will be taken from actual professional, I will discuss with the sound crew times the tip about "Micro in the" Muse injected directly into the action. And a second camera I have now probably been synonymous.

How well that the concert is only in 2 months ... Pooh

However, I am still not entirely clear why the synchronous matching of Sound and the various clips to be that simple? Or do you mean that as long as I do not have the delicate fingers of the pianist in the Picture, The before anyone noticed (had I think someone mentioned synonymous)?

But at the latest when the audience clap (what will they do then hopefully ;-)), see it but from slightly modest, if not next to the pianist rumhämmert wing. And the sound should be continuous but, if possible ... or am I doing now a fallacy?

But as I said, even now many thanks for your numerous tips and tricks. I generally like to learn, and it was synonymous only that I should never do that again :-)

Much greetings, Debug



Antwort von Dr. Walter Gesierich:

"Debug" wrote:
... I am still not entirely clear why the synchronous matching of Sound and the various clips should be so simple? Or do you mean that as long as I do not have the delicate fingers of the pianist in the Picture, The before anyone noticed (had I think someone mentioned synonymous)?

It is a pleasure to watch s.Deinem thread your learning curve of 0 to 90
I think it's great that you fallen to your job here so self reinstellst, and of the others, I find the advice very well, nice in the margin between good amateur and semipro.
But now for the quote: If you mess up your reputation will not, what other speakers have noted some very attentively, then you pull the rein:
Synchronicity. There are people (audience) to remember which did nothing, if it means with the cut to be a crappy movie. And there are a paltry accordion players like me who get in old shoot from the 60's an Kasper, when a woman Enver risers s.Klavier plays to his beloved one schmaltzy Sonata, the camera deliberately never it together shows with the keys, but discreet of behind the wing the face of the hero shows, and you still s.Bewegungsmuster recognizes that the man on the recorder lessons is not gone.
Hey, the movie is something like s.sofort of the bottom through.
And things like that happen you may not be in sync, because the film really look at professional musicians. So strictly s.beim you cut!
You know, I say all this with NEM wink, but it is true nonetheless ...
How it looks just Walter



Antwort von srone:

If you film or record sound throughout is the ton already, although very rough, but still relatively synchronously before, now you need only find one in places where the pianist plays very high or low on the buttons and the buttons you have in your picture, then it should not be that hard to imagine such herauszuhören and synchronize with the visual, can be synonymous not very far away from the building. another possibility is to look at the tone of the camera as a waveform display of the timeline in waveform display plus the external recording then you see the almost offset the (wave form) must be seen in time images coincide.

lg

SRone



Antwort von Frank B.:

A separately recorded audio file of the different cameras and the recorded video -/Audiodateien can be cut in the timeline a program to synchronize well when all done with an audio pulse. you put video cameras on top of -/Audiodateien different tracks in the timeline, and looking hopefully in the continuous (uninterrupted) recording a strong audio pulse (eg the beginning of a distinctive piece of music or a part of applause). The momentum must not lie here s.Beginn the recordings. It may be synonymous in the middle or towards the end. The important thing is that he is so striking that you can synchronize the video -/Audiostreams the cameras after this pulse. That is, the impetus must poss. be placed above the frame accurate. Then the camera angles run synchronously into the timeline. Here are the characteristics of the respective cutting programs must be observed. Some already have a function that automates this procedure. Otherwise, it is synonymous manual. Most editing programs I know are set up so that the overhead track is present. This is then displayed in the preview. To make visible the underlying trace, we must unravel the overlying each lane s.der that body intersect () and they roll so to speak. One can imagine the s.besten such as lay several rolls of wallpaper, which are the same length and width of each other. To make a lower s.einer visible place, I have to roll away and the overlying cutting a piece. It must be noted that the common beginning and the end of the joint roles do not move along. Most Schittprogramme offer different Schnittmodi. One that the "role" so winds up that it stops s.der interface and the end or the beginning of the roll is used. But you must choose the mode (different names are in the editing programs) that are attached to the end / beginning of the remains and moved away from the intersection of the role. So you have to somehow insert gaps without that shortens the duration of the project. I hope you understand what I mean. Based on the editing program do you do with a gap in one or more overhead video tracks, the next lower lying Video recordings made public. You thus allow the representation of current best camera setting s.jeder place your timeline.
To get an even more continuous, high-quality sound, extra audio track should be equipped with it. The sound can be either of an external recording device in question or of any of the overhead camcorder recordings. This soundtrack must then be extracted, of course, so it is available uncut. The audio track is produced basically the same with the video tracks and also on the synchronized traces contained in the video and audio files contained in the sync pulse. After that, all other audio tracks (which are included in the various video tracks) will be muted. It looks like when playing from the timeline the video tracks, which are of above-considered free and you hear the continuous sound of the audio track.

If you tell me now that you have an editing program that only has one video track, I'll take my knitting NEN and throw myself behind the train;)

Frank



Antwort von Debug:

"Frank B." wrote:


If you tell me now that you have an editing program that only has one video track, I'll take my knitting NEN and throw myself behind the train;)

Frank


Delicious :-) Yes, I had not mentioned that I want to make the whole thing with iMovie? Well .... I'll make in the PP.

I'm going all the posts here alone again lead to heart your comments .... but I will even print out and try to understand and to ask for ;-) This is now not as a pejorative to understand the other posts to.

On the contrary, I find it almost unbelievable that you actually give you much trouble to reach a total Beginners to here on the ground.

Many greetings, Debug



Antwort von srone:

in principle, he says the same thing as I did, he speaks of a clearly identifiable audio event (pulse), I see the whole as waveform images, and in enlarged representation synonymous again standing event in the foreground, which shows waveform image you pp the Expand the audio tracks auto.

much success, maybe we even get to see time you finish?

lg

SRone



Antwort von Debug:

"SRone" wrote:
in principle, he says the same thing as I did, he speaks of a clearly identifiable audio event (pulse), I see the whole as waveform images, and in enlarged representation synonymous again standing event in the foreground, which shows waveform image you pp the Expand the audio tracks auto.

much success, maybe we even get to see time you finish?

lg

SRone


Yes. I had synonymous understood as such.

Whether you get to see it? Well, the concert is in June, with cutting and ..... yes, then probably I should be so ready for Christmas ;-)))

Joking aside ... As I said, cavort in my circle of friends so some professional musicians. I will be two or three if I'm ready once the Project, and invite you to play for the times. And then look what the times say. Just because I might s.end with my work should be satisfied That is still no guarantee that it really is good.

And THEN I'll show you the Erbebnis course synonymous ... you are always were, "the fathers".

Many greetings, Debug



Antwort von Blackeagle123:

Too bad that you have no drums, which could count in eg. Since space is no longer a problem, however, go in front but just her concert, turn all the cameras directly onto FOH and propose s.Microphone the door. Then all the cameras on stage and off you go. If the whole course, happened in front of one hour concert and you film on miniDV is already problematic.

How long is this concert going anyway?

Eighth synonymous to the fact that you are not the audio track of the camera sync with the audio track of the recording. For by the time delay of sound in a certain distance, the Picture contribute quickly asynchronously.

Good luck with your project!



Antwort von joey23:

Even cool, what are here for "expert advice".
Roll Spider, zoom out and her film, the dress rehearsal. People People ..

My post is on top of still incorrect. With a camera that is nothing. In any case. Sound and sync but can be quite easily get a grip: Please sound engineers on site to record the concert completely. In most cases this is then minidisk. And after you put in the video.
All Cams you can go through without interruption, and change your turn the tapes, so that always at least 2 Cams to run in any case.

Joey

PS: or leave the job to someone who knows, and then synonymous appropriate Money earned it.



Antwort von srone:

@ Joey
I have short you considered to answer, but it have to get out, which is no objection to insert a roll spider, if mans can be very realize good rides so that if no mans can, then can you just better put, the head in sand and screams for more cameras, the thread anufacturer but obviously at the time the question had not, I would be interested how you would solve the whole with a digital camera may not know, but it helps the occurrence does not then next.

lg

SRone



Antwort von Debug:

"Blackeagle123" wrote:
Too bad that you have no drums, which could count in eg. Since space is no longer a problem, however, go in front but just her concert, turn all the cameras directly onto FOH and propose s.Microphone the door. Then all the cameras on stage and off you go. If the whole course, happened in front of one hour concert and you film on miniDV is already problematic.

How long is this concert going anyway?

Eighth synonymous to the fact that you are not the audio track of the camera sync with the audio track of the recording. For by the time delay of sound in a certain distance, the Picture contribute quickly asynchronously.

Good luck with your project!


Thank you ... Can I do well ...

The concert will take about an hour, possibly longer something. This is the way to a pure solo concert, so nothing with orchestra or something.

Many greetings, Debug



Antwort von Debug:

"Joey23" wrote:


PS: or leave the job to someone who knows, and then synonymous appropriate Money earned it.


Hmm ... not a good idea. First, I get no money for example, would be synonymous even better ;-)

I would also like to learn something. And make mistakes. And next time make it better (if there should be a next time).

As I said, these recordings are not synonymous for television or something. This is a purely private concern.

Thanks and many greetings, Debug



Antwort von Bernd E.:

"Dr. Walter Gesierich" wrote:
... The tip with the recording snippets at the dress rehearsal, I find an idea for saugute lone ...

The principle can be quite extend far beyond the lone plane out. We have recently introduced a "slightly" larger production (symphony orchestra plus soloists, four cameras for ER-TV) in the same way rotated and got so besides settings that would have been during the concert is not easy to make.

"Joey23" wrote:
Even cool ... what are here for "expert advice" ... filmed at the dress rehearsal ... leave the job to someone who knows, and then synonymous appropriate Money thus earned ...

Wonder you then please do not, if this is exactly why people record the rehearsal synonymous, because they know it ;-)



Antwort von domain:

Here is an example of three pop recording snippets that were taken before or after the Originaltake.
If you look closer you notice of course that the fingering for the trumpet part is not consistent with the sound, but the audience does not notice it as quickly.
http://www.vimeo.com/10880146
At that time I still quite like to do a lot of zoomed :-) I do not anymore.




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