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Was muss ich beim Dreh beachten? (mit Sony FX1)

Sony HDV FX1 help - please briefly



Frage von piano:
Juni 2005

Hello,
I very quickly turn a music video. The camera will be SonyHDR the FX1. Here are my questions:
What should I consider when filming?
Can I cut the material smoothly with Adobe Premiere Pro 1.5 and a decent PC?

I do appreciate every comment.
Gruss



Antwort von AMH:

It depends whether you want to cut HDV or SD?



Antwort von Strahlemann:

If you want to shoot a professional video you should think Waveforms and maybe a lot of light, to pick the maximum dynamic range and can be used to assess ...

Music videos are always great games and post as you should already have the best quality available ...








Antwort von WeiZen:

"piano" wrote:
Hello,
Can I cut the material smoothly with Adobe Premiere Pro 1.5 and a decent PC?


Moin,
yes on a 3.06GHz PC with SP2, the minimum should be possible.
But properly? I think that you should resort to Canopus Edius.
With the current version 3.31 you can in real time in the Canopus HQ codec lossless capture, ie the m2t transport stream of the FX1, the process is just so tough, it is converted to lossless. During the m2t stream only in a slip on the plate arrives, you have in the transformation with the HQ codec, the once familiar scene separation as in DV, but not otherwise.
At first the APP m2t captured it with a tool is changed, scene separation by hand, it's not for me properly.
Furthermore, it is me with Edius on Aldi Medion Notebook 2 / 2004 with only a 60GB hard drive managed a cut HDV movie play smoothly with each 2 seconds every 10 seconds Disolve without rendering. This I managed not even with DV and Ulead MediaStudio Pro7. (If available for the video data is not a separate plate)
Conclusion With Edius is a reworking of HDV with DV as possible.



Antwort von Wiro:

"Wheat" wrote:

At first the APP m2t captured it with a tool is changed, scene by hand separation

Wrong, Ulrich.
I just pretty extensive experiments with Appro FX1 footage and behind me - on a 3.2 GHz / 1 MB RAM.
The conversion of m2t in the CineForm Intermediate happens naturally while capturing a scene separation is possible. The clips are then as. Avi in the project window of Appro and are just as processed further as in DV / SD. Real-time preview is available, with more complex effects of shaking or jerky preview something - for a quick preview is not enough.
The rendering of course, takes longer than DV / SD, otherwise I can say that no great difference to the DV processing. Nevertheless, it clearly makes sense for HD to use a hardware-Booster (for example, NX) to. But that is synonymous useful for DV if you real "real time" would have.
Greeting Wiro



Antwort von WeiZen:

"Wiro" wrote:
"Wheat" wrote:

At first the APP m2t captured it with a tool is changed, scene by hand separation

Wrong, Ulrich.
I just pretty extensive experiments with Appro FX1 footage and behind me - on a 3.2 GHz / 1 MB RAM.
The conversion of m2t in the CineForm Intermediate happens naturally while capturing a scene separation is possible. The clips are then as. Avi in the project window of Appro and are just as processed further as in DV / SD. Real-time preview is available, with more complex effects of shaking or jerky preview something - for a quick preview is not enough.
The rendering of course, takes longer than DV / SD, otherwise I can say that no great difference to the DV processing. Nevertheless, it clearly makes sense for HD to use a hardware-Booster (for example, NX) to. But that is synonymous useful for DV if you real "real time" would have.
Greeting Wiro


Thanks Wiro, then I have understood this wrong in the CV. When capturing the RT I had not understood that.



Antwort von wolfgang:

Willi, AP is actually already in capturing virtually "on the fly conversion into the Cineform codec - including automatic scene separation? Or is that just the addition of Packet with Cineform possible?

Otherwise, it should be pointed out that by now synonymous AV Cutty Automatic scene separation of the material can Cineform.



Antwort von AMH:

"piano" wrote:
Hello,
I very quickly turn a music video. The camera will be SonyHDR the FX1. Here are my questions:
What should I consider when filming?
I do appreciate every comment.
Gruss


While filming with the FX1, the lighting is very important! I have a few weeks ago also has a clip made with the FX1.
The Raper is underexposed in contrast to the background sometimes. A little more light would not have hurt. Unfortunately, the budget was not in it: D-No Budget

Gruss

Alex



Antwort von Wiro:

Hello,
would like to return briefly to the original post. Unfortunately, the questioner piano no longer reported - seems more like a question at random to have been.
"piano" wrote:
The camera will be SonyHDR the FX1. . . . Can I cut the material smoothly with Adobe Premiere Pro 1.5 and a decent PC?

We sat down some time ago for an afternoon and tested FX1 footage with APPro1.51 under real production conditions. The aim was a 4 - to 5-minute film, ranging from capture through to a finished DVD in HD format. Indeed, we did s.einem afternoon.

We were initially taken on a lot, but then surprised at how smoothly everything went. Cutting machine was a 3.2 GHz / 1 GB RAM/150 GB hard drive. When capturing, the m2t-avi converted into a stream in the background, while Adobe recommends to turn on Automatic scene separation, because it might come at too long a file to a divergence of video / audio. In this recommendation, we have respected. After stopping while you capture (we do not have gecapturt entire tape, but only about 10 minutes), a window appears transcoding active "- it remained visible for about 1 minute, then lay the avi files in the project window of Premiere, and was in the Timeline be drawn - as synonymous with DV. That the real-time preview of effects in the film montage at times shaking or jerky, I had already written. We have in the assembly some "nasty" built like PiP, color correction, drop shadow, flip, flip, speed and things like that. The system came during the unger will better real-time preview sometimes stumbles - as expected. After a brief Zwischenrendern was then a completely liquid playback to see - also as expected.

After the completion of the film, we have directly from the timeline out a DVD-compliant elementary stream can be expected and this in DVD-Lab invited to the authors. DVD-Lab can produce in the latest version of HDV DVDs. As a criterion, we issue "on a 4:3-Letterbox television show have selected. The burn process went off clean, the two z.Vfg. standing DVD player, the DVD and have recognized lettergeboxt shown.

We then installed the trial version of AspectHD to assess the performance gain. AspectHD brings its own presets and Drivers with, and - what we previously did not know - synonymous own transitions and effects. It's like Canopus, where for a true real-time Canopus's proprietary effects must be used (with this kind of work I am) by my work with the Storm and Premiere familiar.

The capturing after installation of AspectHD accelerated markedly - the 10 minutes source material were practically on the fly in the project window. The subsequent film montage using the Cineform's own transitions and effects then showed real time preview, which we drew a surprised Aaaah. Conclusion: just as when working with Canopus, it is appropriate to use the HDV-specific effects. When we use version of AspectHD had rolled up a total of about 40 Transitions and effects here, ranging from simple Aperture to Page, color correction and motion effects.

To come back so once again to the original question of piano: Appro is well prepared for HDV, calls for a decent power PC and when it will be something professional, synonymous to AspectHD of Cineform. Then a "problem" is nothing to prevent editing.

Beg your indulgence if my posting has become a bit longer. Will not happen again ;-)))
So have fun with the music clip production.
Greeting Wiro



Antwort von piano:

Hello & Thank s.alle respondents have (especially Wiro). I will adhere s.eure tips and get started. If you have problems I'll report me again. Synonymous, and if all goes well, who I share my experiences with you.
Gruss



Antwort von Wiro:

Hello @ piano
Would like to once again bring the thread forward.
Meanwhile, a month has passed. Read more with you here?
Do you have some interesting experiences?
Interest on our part would be available. . . ;-)))
Greeting Wiro



Antwort von spinakis:

I'm finally with 2.0 and the APP SonyHDR-FX1E HD captured. The Sonywird as A / V Tape Device in Windows XP recognized.
In Premiere, you simply submit an HDV Project (is disabled in the tryout version!) S.and press F5:). Then the "Record" button in the software and press the "Play" - Button s.der Cam or in the software. Direct preview during the Capturing with Premiere available materials is not possible for the program, but notes the HDV data and converts it directly into an intermediate well (only I-frames) to MPEG2 codec (endung is then MPEG). Thus can be on my system (Core 2 Duo with 2GB RAM easily cut and 2x250GB hard disks) ...

Who wants to have a preview directly in the capturing, should look at HDVSPlit ...








Antwort von spinakis:

That is just not HD more .. ;)



Antwort von wolfgang:

"Anonymous" wrote:
That is just not HD more .. ;)


Why? If this is runterskaliert of HDV to SD?



Antwort von spinakis:

This will compress! And export is again compressed, so the loss! Mpeg is a final format, which is not fit to edit!



Antwort von Strahlemann:

Small correction ...

MPEG GOP is in the process for limited use ...
In MPEG I-frame method is very well suited -> SONY IMX

And according to trade magazine is synonymous worked s.einem new prosumer codec, which is based on this technology ...



Antwort von spinakis:

"Anonymous" wrote:
This will compress! And export is again compressed, so the loss! Mpeg is a final format, which is not fit to edit!


So if, then you meant renewed encoding. But this really happen? I do not think one can smartendern synonymous - or about to convert transport stream to program stream completely lossless.

And how wrong is that once a valid opinion that you can not edit mpegs - well, lots of editing solutions now provide the means synonymous native HDV editing. Times are changing ...



Antwort von Strahlemann:

"Anonymous" wrote:

And how wrong is that once a valid opinion that you can not edit mpegs - well, lots of editing solutions now provide the means synonymous native HDV editing. Times are changing ...


Yes, but once you apply an effect, pixel-oriented is to be presented in the GOP and the images are recalculated ... how this is supposed to work natively is (a serious question)?



Antwort von wolfgang:

Well überleg times: our HDV camcorder today to draw in transport streams - that is in mpeg2, with GOPs (let's leave AVCHD) on the page.

Once the material now, I can touch the cutting, and more than pure smartrendern do, and that is virtually always the case when I make effects, titles, color correction, etc., so in all these cases, the NLE from the m2t stream with his GOP structure always recalculate the individual images.

Without which there is no cut. The synonymous true when umrendert an intermediate with I-frames only, and that it intersects. Then stop is the back-calculation of the individual images in the rendering process to Intermediate.

So long as I jump out from the native material reckon out my effects, transitions, etc., I lose nothing s.Qualiät what I would not lose anyway. Therefore, the development manager of Sonymal commented in the Sony forum:

Quote:
Subject: RE: Our Thoughts and Impressions of Vegas 7.0
Reply by: Forum Admin
Date: 10/13/2006 6:53:51 PM

If you are doing a render to new track or something similar that requires multiple generations of intermediates, you would be better off using uncompressed (the best option) or some format with less lossy compression for these intermediate renders than long-gop MPEG-2.

However, you are not going to get that _better_ quality by compressing the original source to any intermediate file first, and then applying fx, and then rendering to your destination format. No matter what the source format is, it gets processed in Vegas s.RGB 4:4:4, and from there it gets rendered to the output format you choose (WMV, DV, M2T etc etc).


The Umrendern to intermediate codecs - how has the Cineform or the Canopus HQ codec - two advantages:

s.braucht to render several generations, such as compositing applications where you have to switch back and forth between different Applications, and in between that renders an intermediate, then the codec will significantly improve the original quality.

b) the preview capabilities of these codecs are generally better because they hold a pure I-frames contain.

Conclusion: as long as we can render into an NLE, which is designed for the native m2t file processing, direct from the timeline, so in reality only renders a single time, you have the problems of generation loss when Umrendern of m2t -> m2t -> m2t not. From my own tests, the gehts relatv (good even up to 2 or 3 generations, rendering synonymous if I would recommend that rather just 1).

However, one needs several generations, rendering, you should think about the use of intermediate codec.



Antwort von Roberto:

Hi,
I was skipped or "claimed" that capture the direct m2t streams with scene detection and the fx1 is not possible?
I recommend HDVSplit that sparks great!
First ever capture Proggi with this, then I edit the next m2t files directly into Vegas. I long for one per rendere uncompressed avi or mpg2 out file and then convert it with super next.
every two proggis (hdvsplit and super) are freeware and do their work without probs and outstanding. Others have worked zb 9gig A large m2t file with no probs s.notebook (dual core and 2gig ram) and rendered in 54min. system: xp sp2 + fx1 with firewire directly s.notebook without additional hardware!
Finally, I would say that I am very satisfied with the fx1, always in hdv HOST and editing and so far have had no probs.
lg robert




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