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Sony 4K Stategie: Angriff auf RED

Sony4K Stategie: Attack on RED



Newsmeldung von slashCAM:
Februar 2011

Hier geht es zur Newsmeldung: Sony4K Stategie: Attack on RED




Antwort von Valentino:

Juhu Sonyhat 4k discovered for themselves ;-)
What snoring nose, not even RED has developed the first 4k Dalsa Camera and but that a few years before all else.

What's more, the RED so slowly delivers his first 5k EPIC and all at a price for the Sony probably can not compete in the slightest.
As for the size, Sony will probably bring back such an F35 race cars out, which is suitable for 3D rigs as good as a sledge hammer to assemble Ikea furniture. Partly because, even analogous S35 cameras are designed to be lighter and more compact.

The whole thing, it helps synonymous nothing that indicates Sony always like a nerd on which they are the only ones a full RGB raster and no Bayer pattern have on their image sensor.
Synonymous with the Bayer pattern to make the R1 and Alexa just horny pictures of all still cameras apart again.

Here are some pictures and videos for EPIC 8:
http://reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=54955



Antwort von mwesthofen:

You speak to me from the heart,
No company has ignored for so long and with such ignorance and worries of the Bedürfinisse scenic cameramen as Sony. RED and have primarily Arri supplied the tool that we need. Sonyhat both in the consumer sector as synonymous in Profiberiech milked long enough, deceived us and not taken seriously. Mainly for the lucrative ENG and Broadcast market expand and even then proceed with a disgusting ignorance. A company that once was an icon of technological development has become a victim of its own sales ..... RIP





Antwort von Jott:

Competition is good for business. Sure, the Sony stuff will be more expensive but it has always been so and which has never harmed - perhaps, therefore, the arrogance. Also not everyone likes the kind of mature RED, cameras and let the customer make a cult of it. The EPIC is the first time still a prototype crutch, picture-sound recording and playback do not work yet. To know that you have read along very closely reduser.net, between all the "awesome" posts. Some have the pioneering spirit needed for such a thing, other does not run as safe a line across the film world.

The market is large enough, as can all find their place. RED is lucky because of the (still) existing 3D hype, but the tiny camera in a double course, is perfect!



Antwort von Valentino:

"Jott" wrote:
Also not everyone likes the kind of mature RED, cameras and let the customer make a cult of it. The EPIC is the first time still a prototype crutch, picture-sound recording and playback do not work yet.

The image display and the audio recording is not really shoot in scenic of distress and it was never synonymous. Most DOP like it anyway if you do not abuse their camera for video playback.

As long as the Video Operator audio and video signal by radio or cable gets, the efficient enough for the director.

During my first rotation as Alexa DIT could Camera synonymous not play videos. On the video combo could look at everything again with the director and sound in older Takes it was a DVD from the average.



Antwort von WoWu:

Well, nice presentation but nothing new. But Sonywar synonymous never known for revolutions.
Dead live longer and now they have refreshed their SR format with a transcoder to MXF einwenig and grabbed a low-rate data layer to make synonymous to 200 Mb / s and halves the Prices for the cassette. And finally, after 8 years they now have the coding synonymous packed into a new chipset.
But what's inside is still an 8-year-old codec.
Advantage: The entire old harware is still working, you can use old tapes and the NLE Manufacturer support has always been the old MPEG4 Layer ... So no need to buy new licenses.
What it concerns a newly developed chip, he has kept out from the subject signal to noise ratio, ie, filling factor and signal distortion in the speech quite deliberately. With colorful layouts and projected stills, especially since he has only shown his sensor against Bayer Still Image, Still without a RGB image to put on the other hand, it obviously makes impression, because nothing can move it.
But at least they have discovered in their new sensors 16:9. Hats off.
And the announced 12-bit refer synonymous only to the raw signal, representing a 10 bit in 2.2.
So: old wine in new oak barrels for 8 years and nothing new.
But actually he has said clearly synonymous (final) there is no 4k Camera. Only 4K sensors ... So then where is the product of Sony 4k?



Antwort von mwesthofen:

I am no friend of REDhypes and sees this development very critical. But with Canon for the fast and Creativmarkt RED ARRI for the budget is left for the high end market .... in my opinion, synonymous for the majority of the projects and thus the huge TV market, because of the ProsRes codecs, the RED snooty Sun rejects. Who turns already Movies?
Who wants a giant camera with Sony tape recorder in Double SDI format. Every producer in Europe which must reasonably look to Money is the DoP to the door of the demands. The only ones that benefit from the old film PostproHäuser their workflow easily translatable to "Digital" and thus make the chain to the rear just as expensive as it ever was.
RED has earned in any case the Jacobinermütze in reolution for the film business. Arri amazingly fast response and with expected quality and unexpected flexibility. Sonyist Looser and the heart and the spoiler in this game. And Avatar is in this equation is a Moglepackung.
Sorry, but I had to get rid of once .... and I do not blog otherwise.



Antwort von Mantas:

oh each camera has its right to exist.

it sucks sometimes with a turn to red, just because it is there. while another would make more sense.

just like the Sony's have their sense.



Antwort von Jott:

"Valentino" wrote:
The image display and the audio recording is not really shoot in scenic of distress and it was never synonymous.


I knew it was coming! One can, for example, synonymous with an EPIC produce future-proof stock footage, and if need be quite alone, weighs nothing. Without a Sound and Play Back? No, for what so the preference is not no that you would wish to have. To come so synonymous, the functions are, according to Jannard just still shut down because the camera otherwise abschmiert, overheated or whatever - is not in any case.

Sonyangeht What: HDCAM SR cassettes are this year (it is, at least) replaced with a new memory card. This is synonymous away the previously obligatory pig expensive deck. Perhaps the beginning of a physical shrinkage of these giant beasts to get out of camera at last. And poor prospects for post-priced houses, then if you can handle HDCAM SR s.Desktop synonymous.



Antwort von WoWu:

But it was very clear, no Sonyhat 4k Camera, only a 4K sensor ...
So where is the product?



Antwort von Jott:

No clue. Perhaps what is betrayed to the NAB. I personally am more improvements in the standard medium-range high praise for 4K dreams I simply lack the paying customers.



Antwort von Valentino:

"Mwesthofen" wrote:
Arri amazingly fast response and with expected quality and unexpected flexibility.

Over two years you call fast? ARRI has only a year after the R1 established in Germany with the development of Alexa has started.
In February 2008 I had worked the first time with the R1, with Alexa's one of the first until the summer of last year.
At the same time, the Red R1 already donated a completely revised sensor ;-)

How do you have her opinion that the R1 only for low-budget projects are suitable times I would like to know.
The problem is rather that such rumors are spread in Europe for so long until they believe.
Of course, the R1 is used very much for low-budget, but this is more favorable purchase price and not s.dem s.der image quality.
In America, the R1 has been used for several years, for blockbuster productions -> http://www.red.com/experience

In Germany, large productions keep in R1: Delicate parasites, diamond wedding scene Frankfurt and many other TV series.
This reluctance is here in Germany but in part due to the structure in the public service broadcasters. It is not just a problem with the RED has to fight, synonymous ARRI has not exactly easy, what the placement of Alexa in TV productions such as the crime scene.



Antwort von WoWu:

I agree with you, so you should take once more in such publications Maketing.
The Sayings of RED, the welcome that describes Sonyden 4k market as a future field.
RED should take a closer look at the interfaces, is offering Sonyda. Then they will see the latest that because nothing really fits in the infrastructure market and Sony is already a step ahead because they have to offer just infrastructure. (Incidentally, all missing synonymous ProRes support in this regard)
Sony remains his line because that is true and you like it or you do not like it, but you will not get past it.
This is synonymous for RED.
That's the difference if I offer a single piece or a system.



Antwort von JossJoss5000:

@ WoWu:

what do you mean exactly with interfaces? I am interested in only what you see here for vulnerabilities in RED.



Antwort von WoWu:

They build the whole infrastructure of their system, consider only the processing times. running out of it because only certain software. You will therefore permit foreign processes in only one, acceptable to them scope.
Since Sony has traditionally there: Your Mazen have always MPEG compliant. A small but subtle difference, because the heist not MPEG kompartibel. So they took such a "MPEG" file and it led to a standard MPEG decoder could, of anything with it. I was working for the EBU itself with it. So only SONY could with Sony Everything else was just a baseband conversion and then re-encoded in standard formats.
Let us only once the new memory card. Great part, only the processor is no longer sitting on the card, but in the hardware.
So nothing, with out in the next Reader and go.
Look at all the workflows that have been mentioned in the osVortrag. Examining the interfaces even sure you will find that again. Synonymous example, the metadata in an otherwise standard MPEG4 signal ... No default. which means that it is fine in the Sony world, but nothing is compatible and just as little foreign signals.
Thus we will have to analyze exactly how one gets what, where and how committed the interface looks like. Or you can consistently buy Sony. That's what the majority necessarily because it is a safe way. But of course the intention behind it.



Antwort von carstenkurz:

There is no institutionalized cinema production, therefore, will be 4k for the transmitter itself uninteresting, making nunmal no movies, but co-produce the technical decisions then others.

If you look at the extent to which now even the prototype EPIC are already booked in blockbusters Sonyda will already have some trouble with a fightback. 3D rigs times to mention.
If the EPIC can enable their first feature set in this huge integration density completely, nobody will come s.ihr. From an island product speaks only as someone who has no idea of the width of the module and lens development and application support on the part of the RED. The system is slow but powerful.
This has to be evaluated including the dissemination of the R1 just strategic. Sure there will be major areas, including slashCAM where RED will not play any significant role. But this need not be synonymous, synonymous ARRI has not sold any camcorder.

The post houses were tinkering in recent years, enough time to get a RED workflow. Any codec benefits are unlikely to be achieved in the area, since RAW is required and simply unbeatable, and no one needs a broadcast-grade, real-time standard codec in 4k. The gap has become small for Sony extreme. Only slightly larger than that for Alexa. Only in the upper Broadcast / HD-TV segment has already half a foot in it.

And actually all hate Sony anyway. But red, because of 4k RED infrastructure will benefit disproportionately as> 4k camera manufacturer.

- Carsten




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